Unbridled Leadership: Elite Equestrian Secrets for Winning in Business

📝 SHOW NOTES:

In this heartfelt and wildly inspiring episode of Captivate the Mic, Elaine sits down with her brilliant, badass cousin Melissa Williams—a 10-time world champion equestrian, ranch owner, and lifelong horse whisperer.

Melissa shares jaw-dropping stories from the show ring (think Olympic-level Saddlebreds and flying horses on “Air Force One” 🐴✈️), growing up with horses in Canada, and what it really takes to compete—and win—at the highest levels.

But this conversation is more than trophies and ribbons.

It’s about:

• How the messiest moments shape the strongest leaders
• Why horses are powerful mirrors for how we show up in life and leadership
• The deeply healing and intuitive connection between women and horses
• And the incredible leadership retreat Elaine and Melissa are co-hosting in May!

Together, they’re bringing their wisdom, humor, and heart to a transformational 4-day retreat for women leaders ready to step into deeper authenticity, clarity, and power—guided by horses, nature, and their own embodied presence.

✨ This episode is for you if you’ve ever wondered:

• What horses can teach us about leadership and emotional intelligence
• Why authenticity beats perfection every time
• What it feels like to lose… and come back stronger
• How to lead from your presence—not your performance

📅 Interested in the retreat?

It’s happening May 7-10, 2025 at Melissa’s breathtaking ranch in California.

🌄 Horses. Leadership. Nervous system resets. Real transformation.

👉 Link to Join Us

🎥 Watch for Q&As and sneak peeks on YouTube and social

🐎 Connect with Melissa:

Want to know more about Melissa, her ranch, or her powerhouse real estate and production work? Check the links in the show notes below.

🧲 P.S. If you’re an expert who knows you need to be more visible—especially on video—Elaine can help you create short, powerful content that captivates and converts. Let’s chat!

📌 Timestamps:

00:00 – Intro & Melissa’s hilarious “no pressure” welcome

06:45 – Growing up with horses (and surviving Alberta winters)

13:20 – Lessons in discipline, heartbreak, and winning

27:50 – Saddlebred history & battle moves on horseback

36:00 – The healing power of horses & emotional attunement

48:10 – Flying horses, million-dollar show rings & Louisville

1:08:15 – From failure to world champion: Melissa’s comeback story

1:16:00 – A sneak peek at the Leadership + Horse Whispering Retreat

1:24:00 – Why this experience will shift how you lead forever

Connect with your Host, Elaine Williams:
Check out Captivate the Mic Podcast on Elaine's YouTube Channel
Check out the Captivate the Crowd Website
Follow Elaine on Social- LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok
Want to schedule a free chat with Elaine? Click here to book a zoom date!

Transcript

0:04

Welcome to Captivate the Mic with Elaine Williams. I think you are going to love this episode where I interview my cousin, Melissa Williams, who is a 10 times world champion it's going to be all the things. And we're doing a, leadership women's retreat in May at her beautiful, Ranch in California, and I'm just delighted. It's so fun to hear her stories and to learn even more about her badassness. And I think you're going to love this episode. So please enjoy. Hi, everybody. Welcome to captivate the mic. I'm here with my beautiful, brilliant, talented, ridiculously powerful cousin, Melissa Williams. Melissa. Hello. No pressure introduction. What, what's left to say? I know sometimes it's Like I used to have these long intros before comedy and they're like, maybe you don't want to say all those credits, it's there's a lot of pressure. So it makes me think of, and here's Daenerys Stormborn, Targaryen, mother of dragons breaker of chains. Is that crown of thorns or whatever or game of thrones? That's right. I only caught a little bit of it, but when I was in Croatia, I was like, Oh my God, I have to watch it now. Anyway, I'm so excited to have you on the podcast. And I'm so excited because you and I are working on the most amazing. Dynamic, fabulous retreat leadership program. So there's so many wonderful things about it. It's hard to capture it in. It is. And everyone might talk about it. Yeah. People are like, give me the link. We will get that to you ASAP. I thought, you know what? Let me introduce you to people. Some people watch on YouTube. Some people are just going to listen. And we're probably going to do some short clips of this, I've had the privilege of knowing you since we were babies. And you're so accomplished and you're so humble. You've been around horses forever and you have over 10 different world championship titles with many different breeds and. I'm like, there's Lobo. Sorry, champion. We're talking like Olympics. Oh yeah. And there's Lobo who's, who is gonna love having people to pet him. Big time. Yes. At a retreat. So if people, first of all, will you just tell us what it's like growing up, learning with horses, like you always loved horses and then you started. Competing with American Saddlebreds and, you shared a little bit about that, but can you tell us more like what you were getting from that? What it was like as a, an adolescent, right? I, the love of horses really, I can't say I got it from my mother or my father or anybody else in my family that, who I know fortunately my parents were very outgoing and they were very giving and, hey, oh, you want to try riding? Okay, sure. And as, as far as I can remember, I loved animals in general and especially horses. And I don't think That's unique to me. I think they're just a magical creature, whether it has wings and a horn or glitter on its feet or whatever, black beauty, my friend Flicka, whatever it is, it's it's, they're fascinating, beautiful animals. I've always loved them and I wanted to ride and then I just ended up at a barn that had saddle breads and American saddle breads and eventually after riding, for a while they asked if I wanted to show and I said, sure. I, my journey in the show horse world was wonderful. I was very blessed, very lucky. And I loved competing. I'm not a, I'm not a super competitive person. I'm not going to lie. It's always fun to win, but I was more about my, the journey, which I didn't really, you're when you're young, you don't think about these things, doing it, right? Whether I won or got. disqualified. I still wanted to do it again. I just really loved the relationship with the horse. And then as, years went by, I, increased my skill. My parents got nicer horses or, a little bit more quality and that helps as far as the result goes and the, when you're competing, that's funny because the competitive aspect of it. It's a little different than most sports because if you're having a bad day, whether you're, even if you're just trail riding your horse, but especially if you're competing and then as the levels get higher and the demands get, more intense, obviously that. That's part of it, but we can have bad days. The horse can have a bad day, but if you can't really take it out on them, you can take your soccer ball and give it a good kick. If you're mad and you're having a tantrum, but soccer ball is not going to do anything. You treat your horse like that. And maybe the next time you have a ride. They remember. And so I think in that way it taught me a lot growing up about controlling yourself, controlling your emotions, controlling your fears and there's always, think about it, learn from the, if it's not the experience you want, think about it, learn from it, and then try better next time. And sometimes that next time isn't the next time. Isn't the golden ticket sometimes. My most hard fought successes with the horse show world with competing were my most memorable moments. It was those times where I thought, I'm never gonna figure this horse out. And there's expectations and this horse, I know this horse has talent. I believe I have talent. Why are we not? Why is my trainer upset? Why are my parents, fussing at the tree, what can I do to be better? And then finally, when the marble does fall in the hole, it's Oh my gosh, it worked. It worked. Yeah. And it may not have worked the next time but the fact that it worked at all was so rewarding. As you mature and get, you learned, okay, relax a little bit about this and, but it's funny because as successful as I was becoming as a competitive equestrian, I always wanted to have horses. With me to take care of, but then it's, wow. A lot of responsibility, a lot of work, but I always wanted that. I always wanted that part of it. And. When my dad was transferred up to Canada for work from Texas. And my mom was devastated. They were small town born and raised Texans and this was a huge step for them. And my mom told my dad we'll go. If this is what we need to do for your career, but we're going to take, at that point, we had a really, we had just acquired a really nice show horse and we're going to take him. And so my dad went and he found a place, somebody that could train him. The first thing I wanted was if we're going to move, could I have a horse out with me? So then my parents looked for an acreage to rent and then we found a mare, she ended up being in full. And so it was two for one and even the getting, but it was my responsibility. I had to get up early every day. I had to take care of them every day. The only times that I can recall that I did not. Was one time I got snowed in at school and my dad was snowed in at work. And my mom actually fed the horses and then it was a white out and she almost got lost. She got disoriented going back to the house from the barn. And she told us later, Hey, if. If the airport wasn't closed, I would have gotten a plane and been out of here. I think she called it this godforsaken frozen, whatever it was. She was upset and it was scary. But other than that, it was very much my responsibility in spite of that, in spite of being, a teenager and wanting to have fun with my friends and this and that. I never. Resented the work involved, the getting up, the feeding, the ice, the water that was frozen for, and so it's always been something that I've really, genuinely love on every level, whether it's competitive or just as, I have what a few that are retired that I call pasture ornaments because they're older. They have some issues and they're having a nice retirement. Yeah, exactly. They're expensive pasture ornaments and I love them dearly. So yeah. And I know you, you loved horses as well growing up and you had a huge influence on. On me and our family, gratefully. And I was just going to say I remember as a kid going to visit Melissa, Uncle Cole and Aunt Melanie and, in the summers, it was beautiful. It wasn't a million degrees like in Texas. Yeah. But the summers in Alberta were gorgeous. Gorgeous. And we would go to BAMF and we would hike. One year we had to build, help build a porch or something like, I remember, and I was a groom and I remember like falling asleep in my dinner cause the exertion was a lot of work. Yeah. And then coming to visit and in this and getting to ski and loving that. But I also remember, like skin freezes in two seconds. And I remember I was like, wait, what? And it was always such an adventure. And, I just wanted to, I'm so grateful that you introduced Saddlebreads to us and showing, because I wasn't very athletic, but I learned focus, determination, discipline. I had this, you knew Patty Milligan. She was one of my heroes. She was my trainer in the Dallas area. The very first show in San Antonio, I won. And she was like, don't get cocky. You are the best of the worst. Like she was, sounds like something Patty would say. And, one time she saw us, we messed up right in front of the judge and she was like, don't give up, make up for it. I learned, some of these things happened like 40, a long time ago, but she's one of those people. And I'm so grateful. Real quick, I want to share something I think you're just going to love. Are you an expert in your field and you know you need to be out there more? And maybe you've tried to do video but you really struggled with it or you weren't consistent or you weren't happy with your results, then we should have a conversation. I love helping people just like you make engaging, connected, short form videos that have people lean in and want more. Look for the link in the show notes and we can set up a call and see if this is the right fit for you. It's time to get yourself out there and stop being the best kept secret. And we're back. And a lot of that was have to do with. You guys sharing your love of horses and, Melissa, if somebody's listening and they don't know what an American Saddlebred is, I know it's like the only true American breed. I believe so. I, there may be others now, but originally they were bred in the United States. They started, as our country was young and and then. They were began breeding them with select stock right about the founding time, the time of the, I think the first saddlebreds were, 1700s. They wanted a horse that up to civil war. In fact, several of the United States generals road, I think for both sides roads, and they wanted a horse that was attractive that could do light Farm work, during the day that could pull the cart. The carriage to church on the weekend, and be a, amiable and attractive. And then eventually these county fairs, they call them, started where they would, take their best horse and compete. And that's where that, that started from. Yeah. And then was it a combination of like thoroughbreds? Because I always think of saddlebreds as like these beautiful, elegant, high necked, high stepping, beautiful, they're just a gorgeous breed. And I know you can probably describe it better. No, that's, originally I believe they, they had the Morgan horse was also a uniquely American breed. Okay. So the story of Justin Morgan had a horse that's where the Morgan horse got its name from. So they did take the Morgans, they took some really good thoroughbreds from England. They called, it was a Narragansett pacer, which is a little bit similar to what we call a standard bred. Those are the ones that. trot and pace and harness. Mostly. Okay. You'll see them on the racetrack. So there was selection of different breeds to try to create this This wonderful horse that could be, like I said, both a family horse and a show horse I have. Two saddle breads here and one that's a half saddle bread, half region. Who is, I'm in love with her. I know you love her, but I'm like, I'm second. Like this mayor is so gorgeous. Okay. I could go on. I'm, horse fanning here. So you grew, you finished growing up in Canada and then. And then I know, you went to college a couple places and then when did you, so you'd always competed and like I did, I competed through, through high school in, into college a little bit. Dad was at that point, you need to focus and not. But I was determined to keep writing. So I did however I could, race, half lease, whatever. I did go to Europe and did an internship. And that's when I, that's when I first met an, and I had my first experience writing an Andalusian horse, which I also love. And tell us about that. That is a Spanish breed. Yes, they're a Spanish breed. Originally there, I think Andalusians and Arabians are really the oldest two breeds of horses. And they both evolved in different parts of the world, but the Spanish horses. Mostly obviously in Europe, Spain and then they branched out from there and the Arabians obviously south of there and so the Moors, back during the Crusade days, the Moors were typically mounted on Arabians and the Spaniards and the the Knights the Crusaders were predominantly mounted on Andalusians or some sort of Spanish stock. Today we have Andalusians and Lusitanos, which are basically the same breeds, but one's a Portuguese and one's Spanish. But, Lipizzaners are also related, they're derived from Arabians. And and so they were bred for different types of warfare. So when That, the knights would fight, fight the Moors. They would they would have these big skirmishes and raids and whatnot. And the and the Arabian horse was bred for Bedouin warfare where you run, they're a fat, they're other than a race horse, they have incredible, they have large noses. They have they're very fast. Tremendous endurance, even to this day. There's several different types of end of Arabians that have branched out, but they're very fast and they're very quick, typically not as large. So they're, run in, steal what you need from the tent and get out, and run as long as you have to without water. they have that, which is people use them for endurance trail rides to this day for that reason. And then the Spanish horses. were a little rounder, a little thicker, big, strong rear ends and they were made for hand to hand combat. You can imagine you have nights with armor and so different attire, different type of fighting. And that's where those, the beautiful what they call high school. Which is classical Spanish dressage at the highest levels where they do like the Corvette and the Levade, these kinds of things. Those are basically derived from battle moves when the horse is doing like what we would call a rear up, but that's a controlled rear where they're back on their haunches and their front that was to protect the night. If he's being hit head on, the horse would rear up and deflect. Deflect the blow or the kicking maneuvers that they would do would be if they were being attacked from the rear. There's a lot of beauty to it. But when you study it, that was, historically those moves. Derived specifically from battle, from, battle movements of the 1500s, when you go to any museum and paintings of these breeds, because that was, yeah. If I was there, I would have been like, don't hurt the horse, get the knight, don't stab the horse, do the knight. I would have such a hard time doing that. Yeah, but, that was a necessary evil at the time, but yeah, I'm always fascinated by like the history, and the breeds have evolved and, I've learned every time I get to hang out with you, I learned so much about horses. And for our listeners and our viewers, there is a world champion horse show in Louisville, Kentucky, and it is basically like the Olympics of American Saddlebred, right? Correct. Saddlebred equitation and pleasure. Those are competitions. And it's equal to the Olympics of dressage and hunter jumper, but they don't, they haven't gone fully Olympic, but they could set the stage. Cause you're so humble. So Melissa, you have to be at a certain level to even apply and go because it is very high level, very. High stress. And expensive. You don't just go to Yeehaw, you gotta be at a certain level. It's like the Boston Marathon. You don't just show up, you gotta qualify. Exactly. And and you hear about the Louis, I've heard about it for years. It's on my bucket list to go. So tell us about, the first time you went. It, it was something that I always aspired to. But then when we moved to Canada, then obviously I went to the Canadian nationals there, that was there and that was great fun years later I had, I was a. I was married. I had my first child and the second one and I started riding, I continued to ride and I started riding again and I ended up getting a horse that was a lot nicer than I thought she was going to be. And then that kind of became a dream. And then the dream started becoming reality. And I remember when my trainer out here and in Del Mar in California, she was. She's always been a very honest, brutally honest wonderful person, great instructor international world class judge and she said, if you win on the West Coast consistently, then It's justified that you go back east to Kentucky and compete at the World Grand Championships. But if you're not winning consistently, consistency, consistently out here, don't waste your money, don't waste your time. And and I kept, her name was Jolie, the mayor, her name was Jolie Blanche, beautiful blonde. She was a beautiful blonde, like Elaine, and she was dark rich, red chestnut. And she just kept getting better and better. She was a little temperamental but we figured her out. And then when we started winning at the best shows out here I was just enjoying myself and and my mom would show her in the driving. My mom liked to drive with the cart. That was her thing. And then one day my, yeah, my, my trainer, Ann said, I think I'm going to take a few back east this summer. And, I think I think you guys are ready. And I said, Oh my gosh, I was all excited, and then I found out, Oh, they were gonna fly the horses, not drive them. And then how much that was going to cost. And then, my parents and my husband, my, he was. He was disinterested because it was expensive. And then, and my parents were, always willing to fan the flames of of fun and yeah, and passion. And so my daughter was about, I think she was about seven at the time and writing, and my son was, he would have been four and and we all went. We flew to Kentucky and Jolie flew and we flew separately. Obviously they call it Air Force one, the big plane that they have. They have no idea. I had no idea that flies them to wherever, kentucky, back East overseas, but anyway, they call it Air Force one and they literally trailer them to the airport. Usually it's Ontario airport and tech Sutton Has a big outfit that does that these planes are specifically for the horses and they trailer them, they get from the trailer to a ramp with high sides and they get on in their stall and off they go. So we all went and I thought I was ready. And first class, you've got to go in and the division I was showing in was intensely competitive and they had, I think they'd split the class like three ways. There was and each class had a ton and it was awful. It's like the best of the best. And exactly. And you know what? These people now, many of them, are friends of mine, are acquaintances of mine I've matured, I've been back there many times now, so it's not, I'm not, star struck. I thought, oh my gosh, that's so and oh my gosh, that's so and so I was I was deaf and I thought, my gosh, you're, really? Really? Really? Really? But I was so overwhelmed and you get there. And it's just, it's glamor. It's a whole week plus of nonstop horse show morning till night. And then you want to watch the work because the trainers will bring the horses out late at night and work them where they didn't, no one's watching. And of course you want to see people are lined up in their golf carts, that and it's right there. And it's absolutely exquisite. Gorgeous. It is a rush. I mean there's concerts, there's the fair, there's the, It's absolutely incredible how many people go to this, attend it, it's, it's like nothing I've ever experienced. They're valued at a quarter million. Oh, millions now. It's incredible and even then maybe the highest price one was maybe worth a million, but yeah. And these people that I'm, oh my gosh. And so here I am, first time there, right? And there's my little mare that I bought for not a whole lot of money. And so we get all ready and they open the gate and we go in and I just was, I'm not really sure what I was doing. I was just having a nice time. I was smiling and we were going around and I was staying right on the rail and all these horses were all over the place. And they're in there, you've got three judges. But you still need to be seen. If they don't see you, they can't write you down. And if they're not right, you go around on the rail, walk, I was on my own little merry go round all the way around the outside. And I remember going past my trainer and I remember her saying, you better wake up. They haven't even seen you. And I went, Oh. And at that point I did wake up and I kind of maneuvered and my ringsmanship started coming to play and I put myself, in a better spot to be seen and at that point it was over. I blew it. And, but I had such a magnificent time. It was an expensive lesson because if you don't get a decent, if you don't get at least six, you don't get to go back in the championship. So the bad news was I had a lovely time and then I did nothing for the rest of the week except watch everybody else have a good time. And I thought, Oh my gosh, if I could just, that old feeling, if I could just do it again. If I just had one more chance, if I, so yeah, it was a tough, it was a tough lesson, but I learned it. And the next time I went, I was, tell us about the next time. And it was a few years it was a few years before I had the opportunity. Maybe I want to say maybe three years before I had the opportunity again. And a different mayor. This was a different mayor, a similar type, actually her barn name was Blondie, believe it or not. And but she was a five gated mayor. And really quick. So the people who don't know five gate, so most most horses, hello, walk, trot, canter, and then there's two man made gates that are gorgeous. One is a slow gate and then the fast version is the rack and it's very staccato and it's actually like you're gliding, but the horses do all this work. It's super smooth to ride when it's done properly, but it's yeah, and it's very fast and it, and not every saddle bread can do it correctly. It's a bigger, it's more intense. More things to go wrong. More things to do right so to speak. So yeah, I, I had an opportunity and I we had done really well. Blondie and I had done really well. And yeah, we went back and we won our division and then went back and we're reserve world grand champion. So we're world champion and reserve world grand champion. But had I not had that first experience was a complete failure other than that. I had fun. I wouldn't have been prepared and, I knew people more. I had been going back and you weren't so green. And yeah, you're on the rail going around, but then you also were like making specific cuts in front. Exactly. In an arena. They call them the peacocks of the show ring, this breed. And the reason is they are show horses, the louder the child, the cloud, the crowd cheers, the better they do. And, in some breeds, like if you're at a very serious dressage show, for example, if you're watching the Olympics, or if you've watched a world games or anything like that, when they're competing, you can hear a pin drop, right? Now. When they've saluted the judge in there and it's over with yes, people will cheer But it's entirely different and this is very much these horses are adrenaline junkies and they love it and the louder the better and it gets loud there because there's a lot of people and Yeah, and so so it was a ton of fun and I was very it was fun. Yeah, that was a great fast forward and tell us about this next. Did you have another time there as the world champion? I did, I've had a couple and in the meantime, my daughter was, it has, she still is, she's actually a trainer. She and her husband have a training barn back in Kentucky. She took competitiveness to a whole new level and I stood back, I took a back seat to, to, supporting her dreams and goals because she was just, Super competitive and super gifted. And so we, fostered that in, in her and went. World cup with her, went to South Africa a couple of times and competed there. And she's won it at Louisville at the world grand champions multiple times and three years in a row. Yeah. Three years in a row. And which is not easy and one of the most competitive divisions there is. that was quite a, quite an accomplishment. And it's funny because the horse that she accomplished it with she was the last horse that my daughter and my dad and I picked out together. And her name is divine asset. Now she's technically world champion, world grand champion, champion, divine asset. She is. Here in the, on the property. She's been a brood marere multiple times over. We kept her retired her, she's got two world champion offspring so far which is very exciting. And we're hoping we can hit one more. And then she would add another rockola to her name, which she would be a brood mare Hall of fame. She's not only was a, she was a very special horse in many ways and a phenomenal ladies in ladies, amateur five gated mare. Not easy. That was, she was another one that taught my daughter some very hard lessons at the beginning. They're, these are high strung horses. And she's very sensitive. They're like Lamborghinis. Yeah. Big time. And there's no, I remember. I've been on her back a few times now, but I had back injury and whatnot. So I didn't ride for a little while, but my, one of my first times back riding, I'd been riding less than horses. And then I went back to Kentucky and the gentleman who's now my son in law, Neil, and he was. putting me on a couple horses in the barn and I'm like, okay, wow. All right. The whole different than a lesson horse. And and then he's you want to write the gray mare? Cause we call her peanut. That's her barn name. Divine asset. Cause you want to, why don't you just bunch stuff on the gray mare? And I thought, Oh, okay. This is a big step up from anything I've just watching her. I knew this in a minute. Yeah. And I'm like, I am just now back writing from, several years of not being able to, and I just remember that she was, she's incredibly kind. You never get the feeling that she's one of these opportunists. We were trotting around and I thought my. Gosh, what an adrenaline rush this is, hang in there, Melissa, don't embarrass yourself, so I was in a hop on baby. Let's go. And here we went. And I've, I'm, think I'm doing great. And Neil says, okay, you're doing it. Good job. Good job. And then he goes, just release just a little bit. And I'm thinking, I know better than to hold this horse strongly in her mouth. Cause she's not going to tolerate that. She's very sensitive, but I'm like, I don't feel like I'm holding too much. But I'm like, okay. And I literally took my little pinky and I swear I moved it maybe a quarter of an inch. Forward when he said that, because I was petrified, I would never admit it to him, but I was like, I don't, first of all, I didn't want to mess the horse up. Second of all, I didn't want to fall. And so the slightest movement and it was like a cartoon, I was going and it was. Absolutely a blast, a complete blast. But I thought, Oh my gosh, there's a huge engine in here. I've never been on anything with that much power, like a tempest in a teacup because you could tell it was there, but she was very aware that she was being a lady, which is not easy for her. Then when I said, okay, let's go, then it was just like, Holy smokes, so yeah, that was, I love that story. It was fun. Yeah, it really was. I'm going to digress for a second because this ties into our journey with. With the concept of this of this executive leadership retreat and including the horses and the environment of the ranch. We were talking about. The Spaniards and the Crusaders and the Moors and all that you hear these stories about how, and pictures, it's the truth, these Bedouins would take their Arabians into the tent with them. That's how closely connected they were with their horses. These Spaniards, if you read about Andalusian horses, they're very much a one on one horse. They look for somebody, one person to connect with in general, other breeds are like, Oh, I can be your friend. I can be your friend. And they're a lot easier going. You can think about it. Okay. If you're a knight and you're off and that's your life is in your horse's hands. Absolutely. And you better be buddies and you better trust that horse and it better be absolute. And so this, that's the evolution of, horses can. adjust their heart rate. You hear the thing that the, and it's true that if you're scared, they know it, they do know it. They pick up on that. If you're aggressive, depending on what your intentions are, they pick up on it very quickly. And like people, some horses are a little more sensitive than others, but Every horse has the capability, and they have the herd mentality. That's how they grow up. We've taken them, domesticated them, and put them in stalls, right? But in the wild, they're herd animals. And even, I call it my little herd here, some of them are in stalls, some of them are in a kind of a more of an indoor outdoor situation, but they're very aware that's their group. And there's a leader, there's a male leader, there's a female leader. And If you watch them at night, even if they're in a stall, they're never all sleeping at the same time. So they watch somebody's on guard, even though I don't know what they think is going to get them here, but it's just instinctual. So keeping that in mind the herd is very in with each other. So when we include ourselves in that, The horses have an ability to adjust their heart rate to hours from I believe it's, if it's three feet, so if we walk up and we're stressed, they pick up on that and they have the ability to lower their heart rate. And cause our heart rate to lower as well. And this is a medical fact. You can Google what I'm saying so that I'm, and so they're huge, empathetic animals. They're empaths to the core. They're sensitive to the core. So you take that animal that has been domesticated along with us for years. We've got the Moors, we've got the Spaniards, then you've got the conquest of the new world. Development of Saddlebreds, like we were talking about the Civil War, where they were with soldiers and they fought and died on the battlefields together. And horses can really be healing. And if you give them a chance, it's fascinating. It's not only fascinating that they can help us. If I'm, if I am sad, they know it. Immediately they know it. And if I'm happy, usually I go up, I talk to him all the time. If anybody had a camera on me, they think she's crazy. I go up there. I'm like, good morning. They all have little pet names, I was talking to them too. I was having so much fun. Did you have a good night's sleep? Yeah. And they respond to it. And they have a lot to teach us, especially in this day and age. And but they are very, there's a reason they use them for therapeutic writing. There's a reason they use horses for wounded war, the wounded warriors foundation and to heal people that have gone through severe trauma because it's a huge. Rush to connect with an animal that's that strong and powerful for one powerful and tender and sweet, right? and what and the horse that you might Connect with the most is not maybe gonna be the one I connect with the most and the one that I think oh god Annoying, I can't quite connect with that one. And then somebody also walk up and they're just In their pocket. That's how it is. They have a very special, intuitive gift. And if we don't pay attention and we, it's very easy to miss, but that's really to me as important or more so than the competitions. And, my, my favorite Stories that are, recently are horses that were very traumatized when I got them from an auction or had been abused neglected those kinds of things. And I love the rehabilitation process and also not just for selfless reasons. It helps me too. I lost one recently that was a, I think he was almost 25 and I had gotten him from a bankruptcy auction and he was at one time I found out later a gorgeous Andalusian stallion that was imported and paid a lot of money for him as a baby and he just, he fell into interesting circumstances and he was just a train wreck. He was a hot mess. When I got it and it took a lot of patience and a lot of time. Yeah. And a lot of, and a lot of love and he was slow to trust, but if you, if he was a real old soul and when you gave him time, he would tell you, he would tell stories, he would go, okay, I have stuff to talk about today. He would just walk right up and put his head down and just, you could just tell he, he was sharing something and. And yeah, that's our journey as a as a civilization, as people with animals, our journey with them and our history with horses goes way, way back. And so we can, use that if you will gain from it, learn from it and things can be applied to our relationships with other people, our relationships in the business world. We all have that one, coworker that you're like, I know he's not a bad guy or I know she's not a bad cow. I know she's good at her, but we just don't get along. We don't see the boss. Yeah, your boss. It's Oh, and it's but sometimes if you put a little different effort into it, and sometimes as people, we don't always realize what we're projecting to other people. And so it teaches us, okay, sometimes you have to adjust our heart rate, adjust our essence, adjust our energy to, to others so that we're not either as so intimidating or so that we have. We're coming into our power versus stepping back, so there's a lot to be learned in. I love it. And, Melissa's place is so beautiful. It's this beautiful home on this in the foothills. And there's this, there's a horse track. All through the town and hiking and it's just beautiful and then she has this magnificent backyard where she's sitting now with an outdoor stove and bar and there's lots of places to sit. We're going to have campfires and be under the stars and then out further back up the hill is where the horses are on premise. And where we're going to be in the stalls and in the corral with them, working with them with our hands and our voices. And it's this process called at liberty, which is mind blowing. And. It's just, it's such a magical thing. And I forgot to tell you this, Melissa, I used to always be I want to ride, I want to ride and so when I first met shadow, who is this magnificent Friesian black stallion, black beauty. And stallions are like, I'm a stud, And most signs that I've met are jerks, you're like, Oh, he's pretty right. Stay back. Yeah. Yeah. And, but shadow was like this magnificent creature, but he had this sweet, so he would nuzzle you and you might nip at you a little bit, but it was all in play. And yeah, I was. mesmerized by him. And I didn't even realize it. Cause I remember, I was here and then we brought my friend Neil, we were trying to teach him and we're doing a bunch of different things. And we only had three days and this is right before COVID. But I remember I just had these moments with him and I had all these pictures where I'm just, and I had never had that experience from the ground and When I went back to the East coast, I could not stop talking about shadow. My yoga friends were like, you are so in love. And he has a huge fan base. That's for sure. He did. Everybody fell in love with him. But I realized like I had a healing, interacting with these horses, just being around them. Not even, we got to ride, but there was a connection that I had never connected before. And then I experienced that again when I was, and I was like, Oh my gosh, we have to do a retreat here. This is going to be amazing. I am so excited. Melissa is a fabulous hostess. The property is gorgeous. Thank you. That's a huge compliment. Yeah. It is just a beautiful space and these horses are so magical. Even though, unfortunately we have lost our beloved shadow in JP, the president looking down on us. And we have lots of other beautiful ones. We have I forget what is the Anna? What's the one Arabella. Yeah. Oh my God. Shadow's daughter. Yeah. He's so hot. She is half saddle bread and all heart and feist and fire. And then her beautiful mother, who is Ella. I don't know why. Anyway, she is a sweetheart. Anyway I'm so delighted and we're going to, we're going to have so much leading up to the event and then the four days on property in deep, a bubble of transformation and. Time with energy and time to yourself and, the promises you're going to leave filled up, ready to go, ready to serve, huge breakthroughs and confidence, leadership, energy management, and really a new level of being able to be an authentic leader. Next level. Is there anything you want to add to that? Melissa? I don't, Everything you said is just spot on and I think it's like you said it's a unique concept. It's a unique experience and I'm very excited for us to embark on this journey and and I thank you for your compliments about the property and my host is seeing abilities. And but it is a very gracious property and it's got a very special energy and which is what drew me to it originally. The horses love it here. And people love it here. People come and they don't want to leave which is a compliment. I never want to leave every time I come up. I know. I, and that's a good thing. That's how you want. Places to be, so yeah, and we've got lots of fun things to do. We have lots of hiking planned and some of it will be optional in case you need time to process it and we'll be doing Q and A's as we're leading up to it. And it's the second weekend in May. So that Thursday through Sunday, I want to say like the 8th through the 11th. So hold that sounds right. And we've got the links coming soon. And there'll be some Q and A's that we're doing. And yeah it's magical. Give yourself this gift but Melissa, thank you so much for coming on the episode and I'm going to have your stuff in the show notes that people want to reach out to you. You're awesome. Thanks. Many other fabulous projects going with real estate and your script writing and product placement. Yes. Many hats. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Bye. Okay.